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kengolf80 · 01-03-2007, 04:21 PM

What handicap is needed for a player to swich to blades or muscle back irons? Any opinions??

shoomba · 01-03-2007, 09:03 PM

there really isnt a handicap point were one can switch irons its whatever you feel comfortable with

Golfbum · 01-04-2007, 12:52 AM

I have one question for you regarding your wanting to switch to blades. How often do you mishit an iron shot during a round with your current cavity back irons? if you answer more than twice then leave the blades alone. The sweetspot on blades is far smaller than it is on CB irons. Do not get caught up in the BS that you can only work the ball with blades. I for one know you can work the ball with CB irons. If you don't that is possible then take a good hard look at the PRO's. Many of them do not use blades.
Don't get me wrong, I am not telling you to not buy them. I am saying that if you are not shooting in the 70's on a regular basis then do not waste your money on blades. I have been around this game for 25 years, so I am speaking with some experiece.
I own both blades and CB's. I am a single digit handicap. The majority of my rounds (last year 123 rounds) are played with the CB's. I own Wishon 550C irons which are forged CB's. They do not have as much offset as Pings, TM or Callaways etc. The cavity back is not all that deep. But they would still be considered CB's.
I own a set of forged blades, and everyone once in awhile I put the 8-9-PW in my bag.
So you decide what you want to play. Just remember that blades are not the most forgiving club you can swing.

Fourputt · 01-04-2007, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kengolf80

What handicap is needed for a player to swich to blades or muscle back irons? Any opinions??

It has nothing to do with handicap. This decision should be based solely on ball striking ability. If you miss the sweet spot on more than 5% of your shots, then don't even think about it. That's the quickest way I can think of to screw up your game. There's a reason why all manufacturers offer the more forgiving cavity back clubs.... most players simply don't have a sufficiently repeatable swing to be able to use blades with any sort of consistency. I had Golden Ram forged blades for the first full set I bought back in 1976, but I didn't really start to truly enjoy the game until I bought my first game improvement irons (MacGregor RPM) in 1985. I will never play a blade again.... it just isn't necessary to put myself through that kind of torture.

zaphod · 01-04-2007, 12:59 PM

It realy is a preference.Annika played with cavity-backed x-14 for many years and has recently switched to newer Callaway cb.
When you hit a sweet shot with forged blades there is no better feeling. And the feedback is great however mishits are awful. I routinely play with Mizuno M14 ( forged blades) Hogan Apex Plus (forged semi-blades) and Callaway x-14 (offset cavities--Cast).

The blades did help me become a better golfer as their feedback let me know whether I struck the ball well or not. That feeling can be hidden with cavity backs. However during that learning period my iron play suffered. Yes the game-improvement cavity-backs do what they are designed for and create forgiveness

The Mizunos have Rifle Lite 6.0 shafts. The Hogan Aldila graphites and the Callaway Rifle 5.5 shafts. The differnt shafts also create completely unique feel with in each set. Shaft selection is variable one must consider besides just the club head. Each of my sets has its assets and deficits and I enjoy each equally.

Choose wisely and happy golfing

**DennisM** · 01-19-2007, 10:52 PM

Fourputt has made the most important point. If you miss the sweet spot 5%, etc.

If you could look in the bags of the PGA Tour professionals, you might be surprised to find the low % of them who still play a muscle back blade iron. Even THEY don't hit it perfectly on the face every time and just like you and me, they want the extra 10 yards that new technology will save them on that mishit.

One of the features I always enjoy in the back of Golf Digest is the one where they have a big picture of some tour pro's equipment. I think you can go on their website and see the examples over the years. It's called, What's In The Bag.

Bobay1956 · 01-20-2007, 10:42 AM

Fourputt is right on here. If you are single digit, compete for the club championship and can practice twice a week, then maybe the blades are for you.

Game improvement irons are what they say they are. Mishits go farther, balls fly higher, stop sooner. I replaced my Eye 2's in the fall with G5's. That was a CB for a CB, but my GHIN has dropped from 11.8 to 10.1. That's like picking up a shot a side. If you go from CB to blades, you could go the other way.

At 50, I play for fun, for $5 a side or a beer. I worked my ass off in my 30's to stay an 8 hcp. I'm having a lot more fun as a 10 now.

Also, Dennis is right about Golf Digest online having the "what's in the bag thing". BTW, the first guy that pops up, Trevor Immelman, is a young gun, won a tournament in the fall and plays Nike cavity back irons.

JPsuff · 01-20-2007, 11:13 AM

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I've played blades for over twenty years and I agree that they have helped me to become a better golfer. I love the feel they offer and more importantly the feedback.

Having said that, I will now say this:

I build my own clubs and have for years. I have been using a set of Snake Eyes 600B's (forged blades), for the last three years and I love them.

But early last season, I decided to build a 3, 4, and 5-iron using Snake Eyes 600C's, (the cavity backed version of the "B's"). Well, I was pleasantly surprised to say the least. They swing beautifully and they seem to almost "throw" themselves at the ball. They seem effortless to hit and there is no noticable loss of feel either.

So, just these past few days, I finished building the rest of the set down to the PW. The weather right now is frigid, so it will be a while before I can get out to the range and check them out, but if the rest of the set is anything like the long irons, I think I'll have no trouble with them.

As has been said, much of the Tour is playing CB's and if they don't have a problem with that, then why should I?

I'm 49 yrs. old and although I can still swing like I always have, I think that maybe it's time to switch over to CB's if for no other reason than to simply enjoy the game more.

Like I said, the long irons hit like butter and the feel is still there. And if they're helping me with off-center hits in the process, well what could be wrong with that?

-JP

zebrasinamerica · 01-22-2007, 12:56 AM

Well I guess I will be the odd one out here in this thread. I for one perfer MB Blades, when I learned this game my parents didn't think I would stick with it so I "bought" some clubs from a buddy that bought them at goodwill for an outrageous price of 50 cents for the set, lol. But anyway these clubs were probably from the 60's or 70's and are all MB blades and this is what I learned with as a 10 year old kid in jr. golf that had never played anything more than putt putt before the latest hobby I had decided upon that summer. I used these irons for 2 years before I invested in some $30 fairway woods from Sam's Club and as a Jr. Golf member I became one of the havy favorites in my age group and got to a 4 handicap by the age of 14. Now I also practiced everyday, not always at the range or even hitting a ball but I would swing my half dollar irons daily working on the stuff my "coach" told me to work on. As I got into high school and started playing for the high school team I was lucky enough to recieve my very own set of CB irons. I was given the chance to watch my handi cap go from a 4 to a 10 to a 12 and so on. At this age tough I didn't quite grasp that the new set of wonderful CB irons that I let the sales person talk me into could be the problem and even if I would have it's not like I would have told my parents the clubs they just bought for me were horrible. I stayed at a 12+ handicap until just a few years ago when I switched back to blades, I am currently at a 5 handicap with high hopes of lowering it still.

I guess with me I rely on the smaller head and fractional sweet spot on blades to keep me true to MY swing and not getting sloppy knowing that it's no big deal if I don't hit it just right. In my opinion the switch to CB irons put my game on hold and injured my golf swing that I developed as a jr. golfer and to this day I am still working kinks and bugs and bad habbits that I seemed to develop over the 5 years that I used my beloved cavity back irons.

Well sorry I didn't plan on this turning into a rant so I apologize and I hope that my experience may help someone out there try different companies irons in CB and MB and decide on what they think not what they read then I guess what I have said will be of some use.

Zebra

JPsuff · 01-22-2007, 11:11 AM

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I think that a distinction between Blades and Cavity Backs has to be made. When referring to Cavity Backs, what needs to be pointed out is whether they are Cast cavity backs or Forged cavity backs.

There Is a difference between them.

Cast clubs tend to be harder and more brittle than forged clubs. Now, the manufacturers will say otherwise, but the proof of this is obvious when bending specs are mentioned.
If you wish to bend your clubs to adjust loft or lie, it is recommended that cast clubs be bent no more than 2 deg. but forged can be bent as much as 6 deg. or more. In fact, some cast clubs cannot be bent cold. They must be heated first in order to soften the metal so that it won't snap under the stresses of bending. A forged cavity back, on the other hand, can be bent just as any forged blade because you're still dealing with a forging as opposed to a casting.

I too grew up on blades, played them for over twenty years and I have always marvelled at the fact that even an off-center hit of 1/8 of an inch can be detected, which allows for tremendous feedback when grooving a swing.
I have switched over from forged blades, (my SE 600B's) to the forged cavity back version of the same club, (SE 600C's). Side by side, these clubs are identical except for the cavity back. They are both forged and as I've said, there is no discernable loss of feel between them.

I credit this to the fact that they are forged rather than cast. I once tried to play a set of cast cavity backs, (They were Titleist DTR's), and I could not feel the ball at all and I suffered the same deterioration of my game that zebrasinamerica complained about. So, I went back to blades and called that experiment an abject failure.

Today, with my newly built 600C's, I have no fear of losing any feel because, as I pointed out in an earlier post), I built three clubs with these heads and actually played with them for the latter half of the season and aside from not noticing any loss of feel, I actually felt that the lower CG helped with ball striking overall.
Of course, when I hit off-center, I know so immediately but the resulting shot isn't as dramatic as it might have been with my blades.

I think that how a club looks and feels is just as important as how you swing it. And when I set these clubs down, side-by-side, there is no difference between them at address. In fact, if someone were to hand me a club at address without showing me the back of the blade, I feel that it would be difficult to tell them apart simply by looking down the shaft.
Most cast cavity backs have a very thick topline which I can't stand. But the topline of my 600C's is the same as my 600B's. Combine that with the same feel, and I'm getting the same club - but with more forgiveness.

To me, that's a win-win proposition across the board.

-JP